Hey all, I'm thinking of using Haxorus for one of the cities I'm attending and was wondering what is the best combo to pair with it? I was thinking either Typhlosion Prime or Emboar (Ability), but I'm not sure and was looking for some advice.
Haxorus-Could it work in the right deck?
- Thread starter DeepSleepDarkrai
- Start date
You could possibly put it with Cinccino to keep the colorless types up or with any other deck really (not any Mew Prime variants though). But Typhlosion Prime or Emboar is the way to go. I suggest Typhlosion Prime and fitting in a few Reshirams. Emboar works well, too, but you would have to have Reshiram, too, because it would be hard to get out 2 stage 2s at the beginning. Plus if you run it with Emboar, you would have to run some Energy Retrievals and/or Fisherman, which takes up space. With Typhlosion, you don't have to do this. So I would prefer Typhlosion to go with Haxorus. Dodrio works as well.
It really depends on how you approach the deck. But, I'm not sure if typhlosion or emboar will help. If you afterburner twice with typhlosion you will be in the one hit KO range for reshiram and zekrom, two very popular decks. Emboar might be better but you have to keep in mind getting the energies back from the discard and the possible catchering up of it. With, a 4 retreat cost, emboar could become a problem unless you have switch which you would probably want to use switching haxoruses. Haxorus pairs well with Dodrio because you can then retreat to another haxorus
Would Electrode Prime be good enough to make it faster?
Haxorus is a very tricky card to play.
There are two problems of Haxorus that needs to be taken cared off as well
1. The penalty of its attack
-Haxorus does three for 120 but the penalty is that you can't use the same attack the next turn. To alleviate this, you could either use "Retreat Aid" Dodrio or multiple copies of Switch. Either way, it will be hard to set up Dodrio and Haxorus quickly enough before it gets outrun bu faster decks like ZPTS who it now can't OHKO unless Pluspower is played assuming the Zekrom has an Eviolite slapped on.
2. Energy Acceleration
-Haxorus requires three for 120 and it's going to get 2HKO in this format no questions asked. So you should have a constant stream of Haxorus waiting around on the bench for this to work. The mentions of Typhlosion and Electrode are good but here are the problems. Typhlosion is also a Stage 2, it makes the deck slower and it gives Haxorus more damage counters making it easier to OHKO. Electrode is risky because you give up a prize for a "chance" to accelerate energy. Someone suggested to me to try Eelektrik (can't spell it i think), It has Typh's power packed into a Stage 1 but 90HP and weakness to Fighting is sorta bad. It also adds another bench sitter to your deck which makes it harder to setup and more Catcher food for your opponent.
Overall the deck can be playable and good but is extremely hindered by those two big problems and solving those problems requires bench sitters which could be pulled up by Catcher and OHKO'd which gives the player less Haxoruses to KO for his win.
There are two problems of Haxorus that needs to be taken cared off as well
1. The penalty of its attack
-Haxorus does three for 120 but the penalty is that you can't use the same attack the next turn. To alleviate this, you could either use "Retreat Aid" Dodrio or multiple copies of Switch. Either way, it will be hard to set up Dodrio and Haxorus quickly enough before it gets outrun bu faster decks like ZPTS who it now can't OHKO unless Pluspower is played assuming the Zekrom has an Eviolite slapped on.
2. Energy Acceleration
-Haxorus requires three for 120 and it's going to get 2HKO in this format no questions asked. So you should have a constant stream of Haxorus waiting around on the bench for this to work. The mentions of Typhlosion and Electrode are good but here are the problems. Typhlosion is also a Stage 2, it makes the deck slower and it gives Haxorus more damage counters making it easier to OHKO. Electrode is risky because you give up a prize for a "chance" to accelerate energy. Someone suggested to me to try Eelektrik (can't spell it i think), It has Typh's power packed into a Stage 1 but 90HP and weakness to Fighting is sorta bad. It also adds another bench sitter to your deck which makes it harder to setup and more Catcher food for your opponent.
Overall the deck can be playable and good but is extremely hindered by those two big problems and solving those problems requires bench sitters which could be pulled up by Catcher and OHKO'd which gives the player less Haxoruses to KO for his win.
Haxorus is a nice little card which falls just short on being playable alongside the ''big decks'' we have right now in my opinion. Given the right support, Haxorus can be a fun deck to play anyways, and it could even catch an unprepared player off guard. I tried a Haxorus deck as well, but for me it just fell short of keeping up with my more competitive decks. I'll explain my own approach below after a small analysis of the card.
Haxorus itself
Haxorus has excellent stats on a stage 2; the 140 HP combined with the ''no-weakness'' can be a good tanking abillity, right? Well, I'm afraid that is not correct. While 140 HP is about ''standard'' for most ''bulky'' Stage 2's, it is not that impressive anymore when you factor in we have Basics that are at 130 HP that run rampant in today's meta. Not only that, they also hit the same impressive damage cap as Haxorus at 120 damage. They also feature an attack which (ab)uses that very high HP; something Haxorus lacks. Haxorus also boasts a ''no resistance'' and a Retreat Cost of 2 like our ''Big Bad Basics''. To finish the ''rant'', Haxorus requires to be evolved, whereas the Basics can be played right away.
However, things aren't all bad. While Haxorus has little to no benefits over some of the most dominant cards in the format, Haxorus also has a two edges. The first noteable one being that Haxorus has no Weakness. Haxorus' typing also means he can work with anything you slap on him, including the infamous Double Colourless Energy. To me, Haxorus' abillity to maximize DCE's potentional is the heart of Haxorus' strength. Haxorus should be used as a speedy attacker in my opinion, in order to get the most out of it. So let's get crackin', shall we?
Three-way party
Aggro
Haxorus can find some partners in energy acceleration pokémon as you suggested yourself (Electrode prime, Typhlosion, and Emboar come to mind immediately, but don't forget the odd Feraligatr, Celebi prime, and the recent Eelektrik as well). However, in my opinion Haxorus doesn't need them.
Tanking
Another way people have been testing it out is in combination with healing cards, namely Reuniclus and/or Serperior. Even the odd Blissey can be encountered, but it is a lot trickier to play due to the energy discard it brings along with it (especially if you're (ab)using DCE as well). The issue quickly arises that these ''healing techs'' can be dragged up front, and that they can be stalled around, or they will simply KO them. As for my own experience, Haxorus isn't meant for tanking at all. With basics dealing 120 damage, someone can easily find 2 Plus Powers or some other way to easily match the 140 damage they need to KO you. ''But you could include Vileplume!!'' No. Just no. I've been hearing this a lot lately, and a little too much for my taste as well. The reason why I strongly fight this statement will be explained later on in my analysis.
The blades cut on both ends
The final option is where I have found my interests the most. While most people look at Haxorus and think ''Hey, he can smack a whopping 120!'', other people (like myself) see the potentional Haxorus offers with his first attack, Dual Chop. For a single DCE Haxorus has a (about) 25% to dealing 0 damage. On the other end of the bargain is a 25% chance on doing 100 damage. These aren't the actual factors, but let's keep it at simple math for now. Something as simple as a consistent Rare Candy, Axew, Haxorus, and a DCE could result in T2 100 damage. Add in Fliptini, and you have an even greater chance of hitting some lucky numbers. And against most evolving basics a single heads and a Plus Power (or two) should be enough to get a OHKO. Though risky and sometimes unreliable, I personally think Haxorus' strength lies in the Dual Chop attack, along with it's colourless typing to (ab)use any type of energy.
While it is totally up to yourself which way you would like to use, I have more experience with the ''Aggro'' and ''Lucky'' versions, and those will be the versions I can cover for the most part.
Aggro
As with any Haxorus list, you should be running about a 4-3-4 Haxorus line, along with 4 Rare Candy. This will mainly be your attacking force, so I see nothing unlogical here. What you add is a big quiz question, really. Some players prefer Emboar/Typhlosion due to their also ''Rare Candy compatibillity'', but to me you should save the Rare Candy solely for Haxorus, and any possible stage 2 tech. I prefer something along the line of Electrode Prime + Twins, which will greatly boost consistency along with some (risky)energy acceleration. Not only that, Electrode allows you to counter a Twins-based deck as well, as you'll be giving up a prize (or two) as well for your Electrodes. Dodrio also often finds itself in this version of the deck, as two Haxorus need to switch in and out during each of your turns to keep smacking 120 consistently. An aggro list of Haxorus should just watch decking, and needs to keep in mind that in between the switching your Haxorus' will be getting some punches as well. Never forget to build up a third Haxorus when you need to, or you'll find yourself in a sticky situation!
Cards which should go in any Aggro Haxorus build:
- Electrode + Twins/Typhlosion/Emboar
- Dodrio
- Rocky Helmet
- Pluspower
Tanking
When trying to exploit Haxorus' HP, cards like Serperior, Belossom, and Cherim come to mind. Of course Blissey and Reuniclus also slip inside most people minds, but I strongly advice against the latter for Haxorus. Blissey mainly because of the discarding, and Reuniclus because of the low HP, and it doesn't heal anything really(it just moves the damage around). Of course trainers like Seeker and Max Potion could provide a good solution here too, but beware of trainer lock. To me, Tanking isn't Haxorus' selling point, and I strongly advice against any ''tanking'' type of Haxorus deck. Don't feel discouraged by anyone's words though, if you feel like playing the deck that way, you're free to disagree with everyone (and even prove them wrong maybe!). The main reasons I don't swing this way is because 140 HP just isn't that impressive anymore, and Haxorus wasn't build to tank in the first place in my opinion. ''But we could use Vileplume in tandem with Reuniclus!!'' Hold on a little longer, I'll explain it soon why this isn't a valid arguement (if you haven't found out yourself already, that is).
Cards which should go in any Tanking Haxorus build:
- Serperior/Belossom/Cherrim
- Seeker
- Defender
The blades cut on both sides
My favorite version of the deck, this version focusses on attacking T2 with at least 50 damage, or when possible 120 of course. While there is not much difference between this version and the Aggro version, this version doesn't mind using Dual Chop over Giga Impact. This deck leans a lot towards a Toolbox kind of deck, and has many options to go with, and I'll list my own idea's here to help you on the way. I'm sure you'll be able to think of some nice combo's as well, and I encourage players to find their own strategies rather than by simply using them from other players. My own version included Kingdra Prime, as well as Fliptini. The idea was to use Dual Chop continuesly, and with the help of Fliptini and Kingdra we should get at least 70 damage by turn 2 out of our Dual Chops, with a possible damage cap of 140 (or 180 if you factor in Plus Powers) for a mere DCE! Just build your first Haxorus, load a DCE on it, and focus on getting out as much Kingdra as you can, as well as building up another Haxorus as a backup, and bench a Fliptini for some unlucky Dual Chop-flips. Because Haxorus can work with anything, and Fliptini is just a basic, you could combine Haxorus and Fliptini with almost anything else you can think of. Just keep in mind the main goal of Haxorus is to use Dual Chop, and only in times when needed you go for the Giga Impact!
Cards which should go in any ''The blades cut on both sides'' Haxorus build:
- Fliptini
Now, why shouldn't we use Vileplume? Mainly because Haxorus is Rare Candy-dependable, since it will lose it's biggest asset (speed) when it can't. Communication is also an important card for any Haxorus deck, and you really can't do without it in my opinion. Of course this shouldn't discourage you from trying it if you'd want, but from my experience I can tell Vileplume based Haxorus decks just perform overall less than those without it. To finish my post, here are some cards that will help Haxorus regardless of chosen partner:
- Professor Juniper
- Professor Elm's Training Method
- Pokémon Collector (duh)
- Rare Candy
- Pokémon Communication
- Switch
(of course there are more, but they are more dependable on what you partner Haxorus with.)
Good luck!
[/sand=James] -Celebi23
Haxorus itself
Haxorus has excellent stats on a stage 2; the 140 HP combined with the ''no-weakness'' can be a good tanking abillity, right? Well, I'm afraid that is not correct. While 140 HP is about ''standard'' for most ''bulky'' Stage 2's, it is not that impressive anymore when you factor in we have Basics that are at 130 HP that run rampant in today's meta. Not only that, they also hit the same impressive damage cap as Haxorus at 120 damage. They also feature an attack which (ab)uses that very high HP; something Haxorus lacks. Haxorus also boasts a ''no resistance'' and a Retreat Cost of 2 like our ''Big Bad Basics''. To finish the ''rant'', Haxorus requires to be evolved, whereas the Basics can be played right away.
However, things aren't all bad. While Haxorus has little to no benefits over some of the most dominant cards in the format, Haxorus also has a two edges. The first noteable one being that Haxorus has no Weakness. Haxorus' typing also means he can work with anything you slap on him, including the infamous Double Colourless Energy. To me, Haxorus' abillity to maximize DCE's potentional is the heart of Haxorus' strength. Haxorus should be used as a speedy attacker in my opinion, in order to get the most out of it. So let's get crackin', shall we?
Three-way party
Aggro
Haxorus can find some partners in energy acceleration pokémon as you suggested yourself (Electrode prime, Typhlosion, and Emboar come to mind immediately, but don't forget the odd Feraligatr, Celebi prime, and the recent Eelektrik as well). However, in my opinion Haxorus doesn't need them.
Tanking
Another way people have been testing it out is in combination with healing cards, namely Reuniclus and/or Serperior. Even the odd Blissey can be encountered, but it is a lot trickier to play due to the energy discard it brings along with it (especially if you're (ab)using DCE as well). The issue quickly arises that these ''healing techs'' can be dragged up front, and that they can be stalled around, or they will simply KO them. As for my own experience, Haxorus isn't meant for tanking at all. With basics dealing 120 damage, someone can easily find 2 Plus Powers or some other way to easily match the 140 damage they need to KO you. ''But you could include Vileplume!!'' No. Just no. I've been hearing this a lot lately, and a little too much for my taste as well. The reason why I strongly fight this statement will be explained later on in my analysis.
The blades cut on both ends
The final option is where I have found my interests the most. While most people look at Haxorus and think ''Hey, he can smack a whopping 120!'', other people (like myself) see the potentional Haxorus offers with his first attack, Dual Chop. For a single DCE Haxorus has a (about) 25% to dealing 0 damage. On the other end of the bargain is a 25% chance on doing 100 damage. These aren't the actual factors, but let's keep it at simple math for now. Something as simple as a consistent Rare Candy, Axew, Haxorus, and a DCE could result in T2 100 damage. Add in Fliptini, and you have an even greater chance of hitting some lucky numbers. And against most evolving basics a single heads and a Plus Power (or two) should be enough to get a OHKO. Though risky and sometimes unreliable, I personally think Haxorus' strength lies in the Dual Chop attack, along with it's colourless typing to (ab)use any type of energy.
While it is totally up to yourself which way you would like to use, I have more experience with the ''Aggro'' and ''Lucky'' versions, and those will be the versions I can cover for the most part.
Aggro
As with any Haxorus list, you should be running about a 4-3-4 Haxorus line, along with 4 Rare Candy. This will mainly be your attacking force, so I see nothing unlogical here. What you add is a big quiz question, really. Some players prefer Emboar/Typhlosion due to their also ''Rare Candy compatibillity'', but to me you should save the Rare Candy solely for Haxorus, and any possible stage 2 tech. I prefer something along the line of Electrode Prime + Twins, which will greatly boost consistency along with some (risky)energy acceleration. Not only that, Electrode allows you to counter a Twins-based deck as well, as you'll be giving up a prize (or two) as well for your Electrodes. Dodrio also often finds itself in this version of the deck, as two Haxorus need to switch in and out during each of your turns to keep smacking 120 consistently. An aggro list of Haxorus should just watch decking, and needs to keep in mind that in between the switching your Haxorus' will be getting some punches as well. Never forget to build up a third Haxorus when you need to, or you'll find yourself in a sticky situation!
Cards which should go in any Aggro Haxorus build:
- Electrode + Twins/Typhlosion/Emboar
- Dodrio
- Rocky Helmet
- Pluspower
Tanking
When trying to exploit Haxorus' HP, cards like Serperior, Belossom, and Cherim come to mind. Of course Blissey and Reuniclus also slip inside most people minds, but I strongly advice against the latter for Haxorus. Blissey mainly because of the discarding, and Reuniclus because of the low HP, and it doesn't heal anything really(it just moves the damage around). Of course trainers like Seeker and Max Potion could provide a good solution here too, but beware of trainer lock. To me, Tanking isn't Haxorus' selling point, and I strongly advice against any ''tanking'' type of Haxorus deck. Don't feel discouraged by anyone's words though, if you feel like playing the deck that way, you're free to disagree with everyone (and even prove them wrong maybe!). The main reasons I don't swing this way is because 140 HP just isn't that impressive anymore, and Haxorus wasn't build to tank in the first place in my opinion. ''But we could use Vileplume in tandem with Reuniclus!!'' Hold on a little longer, I'll explain it soon why this isn't a valid arguement (if you haven't found out yourself already, that is).
Cards which should go in any Tanking Haxorus build:
- Serperior/Belossom/Cherrim
- Seeker
- Defender
The blades cut on both sides
My favorite version of the deck, this version focusses on attacking T2 with at least 50 damage, or when possible 120 of course. While there is not much difference between this version and the Aggro version, this version doesn't mind using Dual Chop over Giga Impact. This deck leans a lot towards a Toolbox kind of deck, and has many options to go with, and I'll list my own idea's here to help you on the way. I'm sure you'll be able to think of some nice combo's as well, and I encourage players to find their own strategies rather than by simply using them from other players. My own version included Kingdra Prime, as well as Fliptini. The idea was to use Dual Chop continuesly, and with the help of Fliptini and Kingdra we should get at least 70 damage by turn 2 out of our Dual Chops, with a possible damage cap of 140 (or 180 if you factor in Plus Powers) for a mere DCE! Just build your first Haxorus, load a DCE on it, and focus on getting out as much Kingdra as you can, as well as building up another Haxorus as a backup, and bench a Fliptini for some unlucky Dual Chop-flips. Because Haxorus can work with anything, and Fliptini is just a basic, you could combine Haxorus and Fliptini with almost anything else you can think of. Just keep in mind the main goal of Haxorus is to use Dual Chop, and only in times when needed you go for the Giga Impact!
Cards which should go in any ''The blades cut on both sides'' Haxorus build:
- Fliptini
Now, why shouldn't we use Vileplume? Mainly because Haxorus is Rare Candy-dependable, since it will lose it's biggest asset (speed) when it can't. Communication is also an important card for any Haxorus deck, and you really can't do without it in my opinion. Of course this shouldn't discourage you from trying it if you'd want, but from my experience I can tell Vileplume based Haxorus decks just perform overall less than those without it. To finish my post, here are some cards that will help Haxorus regardless of chosen partner:
- Professor Juniper
- Professor Elm's Training Method
- Pokémon Collector (duh)
- Rare Candy
- Pokémon Communication
- Switch
(of course there are more, but they are more dependable on what you partner Haxorus with.)
Good luck!
[/sand=James] -Celebi23
It can work wel in the truth as it hasno weakness and over 130 hp. If you put it with Emboar put in promo shuckle and shaymin to keep your draw consistant